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Random DMZ

My CDF 2 cents worth!!!

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Hello guys, i am Eric also known as Random. I was one of the many who made the Colorado platoon happen and also played CDF. I did not play a CO or a XO or a squad leader, in fact I came to broken home to help AMS if they needed it, THEY DIDN'T BECAUSE THEY HAD THE SHIT ON LOCK DOWN!!!!!

 

I keep hearing the SAME things over and over, cdf wasn't, we couldn't. So I would like to address them.

 

First, CDF NEVER switched sides. PERIOD. If a squad did it was a violation and command did not know about it and would have NEVER let it happen. In fact twice in the event it was EVERYONE vs us. thats 420 plus vs 78 or less. 

 

Secound, who tells us what we can or can't have? WHO ARES IF WE ARE CDF? no rule says we can't have armor? nothing says we can't win? Its everyone elses job to beat us. Only reason to complain as far as I can see is because everyone expects the CDF to be a group of non effective players? Well we where not, I am glad we didn't live up to everyone's expectations. COLORADO HAS TEETH!!!! SHARP ONES!!!

 

Next Camo, Most of us wore easy to see stuff, in my squad we had one guy with a ORANGE Hawaiian shirt and another guy with a white and blue jester shorts, I personally worn grey camo shorts and a green 7.62 design shirt. We where asked to wear a green item to show cost support, and have a tan at the ready JUST IN CASE. I even bought a green cap just to follow the rules.

 

Last, as a whole we can only police ourselfs so far. I know for a fact small groups of people did not follow the rules, and for this I am sorry, you can only do so much. Steps on our end are being take to prevent that in the future. But in the same breather I saw these problems on both Cost and UFS also. As a whole we can only do so much, someone will ALWAYS not listen that,s life. 

 

Here is where I make everyone mad, I think CDF won and OK should be declared a FREE STATE OF THE PEOPLE =)

 

THANKS GUYS FOR THE GOOD TIME !!!!!!!!!!! If you are upset, look within cus I did my best to make everyone happy as all should have!!!!!

 

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The only time I know of that it was 'everyone against CDF' was with the night game, and that has no bearing on the storyline.  (In any sort of DAM, which that was, Factions do not count.  The P-DAM had no bearing on story, and CDF was fighting for CoST in this instance.

 

That being said, At no time did I personally ever see CDF flip flop.  They did fire on our vehicles at the beginning of the day, without provocation from anyone in said vehicles, but it's possible that some of the troops on foot not associated with our squad were firing on CDF when they came rolling in without prior announcement.  Situation of bad place, bad time I think.

 

And no one said that CDF couldn't have armor.  I said that I personally believed Lexan panes of 100% coverage was a cheap way to become invincible.  (Real Steel armor is just that.  Steel.  You can't see through it.)  That's something between you guys, your CO, and your own conscience.  Our squad specifically decided to -not- use Lexan panes as armor plating on gun mounts because we thought it would be too cheap.  Everything else on all of the vehicles I had no problem with.

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I was running with Cost and our first real fire fight was with a CDF squad. We were fire apon first and a vast majority of the CDF squad was wearing mostly Tan. After the fight was done everyone laughed it off and we all shook hands and went our seperate ways. As far as CDF flip flopping...In one engagement at the bridge Cost forces got pushed back and i was cut off so i waited for a window and took out as many tan tan as possible before being shot. And yes there were CDF fighters fighting with tan. Spoke with one and he said at least one group had switched sides. That being said, I am pretty certain all three forces had rouge groups doing whatever they wanted.

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PREACH IT! hahaha Every side made mistakes, but CDF was always suppose to be with COST and the most of us in CDF were. That final battle/push on Sunday was a great example. CDF pushed UFS all the way back to the bridge and it was one of the greatest games I have been apart of!

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So... "command didn't know" equates to "CDF didn't flip".

Not to start an argument based solely on semantics, but I was a victim of your "miscreant squads" flip flopping more than once.

In my eyes, that's CDF flipping sides. whether or not you all did it, someone did, and that's why it became 420 on 78. 

As for armor, I don't have an issue with you guys having armor, I have issue with you guys being assigned to COST from the start to account for the balance  issue of UFS being larger. 

We were maybe larger by about fifty people than CoST [according to JP, in field, actual numbers may vary]. This does not in any universe equal giving the other team 78 guys and six more technicals, one of which was effectively invincible. [which was the only one of your vehicles I felt was unfair solely from a vehicle gameplay standpoint]. 

I think the game was at it's best when we were all fighting a 3 way fight, personally, it made the game a million times more interesting for me, because whoever "owned" an objective kind of decided the sort of fight we'd get. if we had to assault a CoST point at that time, it meant a good chance of a nice infantry fight, but once ya'll were on your own, fighting the CDF meant having to get a bit more creative.


However, all of you combined was just unbalanced. The end. Did it break the game? no. But I really don't want to have to put up with it again. 

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UFS had 15 more players based on what registration told me. this includes the number of Cdf Plus cost.

 

When it was 420ish vs 78ish I didn't complian I LOVED IT.

 

BAD ASS EVENT!!!

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I agree with Random, it was a great event.....well ran...lots of fun. As always, there are things can be change; we only learn by trying. The CDF ran with-in the limits of the AMS rule book for this event, but I do not like to hear that a small unit of CDF flip-flop causing the CDF to get a "bad name."

As a Colorado team player I know that our upper command was very stricted about playing by the rules and if any player was found "cheating or playing our side the rules" they would removed from the AO and game.

 

Thanks Random for you support as always!

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Fuuny part is they didn't bring up the fact we had NO respawn point. So if the vehical was not dead we had to walk back to camp if we bleed out or dead a third time. I walked back three times. As far acrost the field as you could walk. :)

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Actually that is not entirely true, AMS told us to use the Respawn points that CoST had mid day Saturday.  On Sunday you are correct we did not have respawn points. 

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Ok again for clarification, the only time it was all tan and green forces vs CDF was prearranged setup on Sat night as part of a special scenario by staff. This had nothing to do with the battle at large. 5280 Tac and our closely allied teams always stayed on the side of green, we supported them to the end fighting viciously. 

 

In addition if it is factual that a team or members of a team acted as such, you can bet they will no longer be trusted to be part of a collective Colorado force in the future. 

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Ok again for clarification, the only time it was all tan and green forces vs CDF was prearranged setup on Sat night as part of a special scenario by staff. This had nothing to do with the battle at large. 5280 Tac and our closely allied times allows stayed on the side of green, we supported them to the end fighting viciously. 

 

In addition if it is factual that a team or members of a team acted as such, you can bet they will no longer be trusted to be part of a collective Colorado force in the future. 

 

Factual? If what you say is true, and everyone on CDF should have been CoST loyal the whole time, here is how this works out:

 

You mean when I walked back from taking a leak in coleville, and all of the guys hanging out in the church decide to just turn on us and attempt a "safety kill" on EVERYONE? Yeah, that was a flip flop.

 

You mean the guys who decided to start shooting with us at least the beginning of the day Sunday? Flip Flop.

 

The guys who got mad cuz we lit em up coming through our lines because they were supposed to be siding with us? Flip flop.

 

 

I'll leave you to figure out who among your ranks wasn't paying attention, but flip flopping is just the worst. After the church incident, CDF remained shoot on site for UFS the remainder of the game. I liked you a lot better when I knew whose side you were on, and when I wasn't shooting at your one super invincible technical. 

 

I'll be clear here though, my complaint was not that any of you were dishonest, or dirty players. No, you guys were all very sportsmanly, I didn't have an issue with any CDF player whenever we did secure a kill on one of your players or your vehicles. however, the fight was ludicrously out of balance. I didn't like feeling like the game was engineered to be a loss for us. Nobody likes that. It's crappy game design, and I'm pretty sure wasn't intended, having attended a couple of these before, but I felt that way multiple times, and it definitely isn't a good thing to have happen. However, you guys were all a bunch of badass players, and gentleman through and through during the game. I even appreciated your attempts at roleplaying when I sent one of the players under my command to try and negotiate with you at the airfield. I have that on film, I can't wait to put that up on the internet...

 

I had to field ALOT of complaining and whining from our players about the balance issue. I'm not saying you guys were in the wrong here, it wasn't  YOUR decision to do this, but it was a problem. I don't like placing blame on anyone though, I would just like to see the problem resolved.

 

 

Anyone remember why we didn't have "flip flopping" PMC's after "game-that-won't-be-named 5" ? YEah. Cuz it was obnoxious. I had friends attend that game, and I didn't need to be there to know how bad it was. The forum complaints spoke for themselves. You can't have flip flopping with such a game changing team. When the sides become unbalance, there are other solutions to fixing it than swinging the balance ridiculously in the other direction.

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As the Pl for CoST 1st plt, I had nothing but support from the majority of CDF for the entire game. You guys were great, good sportsmen, and a fun opfor during our P-dam. There was one squad of rogue Cdf on Sunday though, all guys I didn't recognize: I asked one we had killed what was going on and he stated their assigned mission was to just attack everyone. A bit confusing, but really not a huge deal from our perspective. They were never large enough or effective enough to do much damage, and from my experience were at least taking their hits and had good attitudes.

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Now that I remember there was an individual dressed in civilian clothes at the end of the game that attacked us while we had Top prisoner. As far as I am aware he was not from our Colorado group . Sounds like we may have had at some fishy stuff going on in the field. 

 

The reason I am so keen on understanding this issue, is we were very frustrated last year with the civilians flipping sides constantly as well. Our goal was to avoid this behavior and be as professional and true to the role we were playing as possible. 

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I hear ya postman.

It definitely happened. I was too busy shooting back to get names, though.

and like I said, I liked you guys better when I knew who you were fighting for, even if it wasn't us. 

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As a Colorado airsofter who did not run with the CDF, I was able to get a tan perspective on the whole thing. There was an element that did offer their services and fire on their own CDF team on Sunday. I won't get into names of teams or specific individuals in a public setting. If you wish to know the W's, PM me. They were paid more than once for this offer (once by myself), but I was not around to see any aftermath of them firing on their own, or fighting alongside UFS forces.

CDF entered into negotiations on Saturday with UFS command, and at NO TIME were they ever friendly. This fact was wrongly reported to me while I was performing duties as the S3, and it made its way out to the boots on the ground. This is a failure to get facts from those in positions higher than myself, either from myself, higher-ups, or both. UFS struggled with communication with their COC all day, which led to its abandonment on Sunday.

 

Speaking of Sunday, CDF had been given orders to attack the UFS COC that morning, and we had been told this fact by those I mentioned in my first paragraph. Myself, and 3 others then decided to make use of an ambush when they decided to roll up on it. However, 4 men against 3 technicals and 25 personnel is rarely going to succeed. Even though I took WAY more fire after I called hit several times, all was settled very sportsmanlike, professionally, and without any bad blood.

 

At no point on Sunday was there any doubt that CDF was hostile. UFS battled hard all day, and lost fairly. While I must say there was some issue with one small sect of the CDF and questionable gameplay, it was passed on to a CDF muckity-muck, and dealt with. Again, I won't get into specifics, because it was handled quickly and professionally.

It all boils down to how you handle yourself and the situation. With hundreds of players coming from dozens of states, there is an incalculable amount of different ways to accomplish the same goal. If you don't like the way things go, either take it upon yourself to address it with those involved, or get with an admin if you don't feel you can address it professionally and courteously with the offending party. Nothing gets solved by complaining endlessly to anyone in earshot. They don't care, they have their own issues to address at that given time.

 

There's a reason CDF rolled over everyone in their path: TRAINING. Everyone on the CDF trained together for weeks ahead of time in conditions similar to or worse than those seen this past weekend. They hit it hard as a cohesive element, and it paid off. Granted there may have been a few that didn't train with them, but they integrated quickly, and it showed. If anyone had a disadvantage, it was the rest of us on UFS and CoST because we all came together from different parts of the US and expected each other to know how each person/squad operated. I can't speak for CoST leadership, as I only saw maybe 3 CoST fighters all weekend on the field, but Top and Raptorkat are keen on recognizing these differences and utilizing their strengths and weaknesses. However, when morale dies in one operator, it spreads like the plague to the rest of those around him. AMS staff tells you this during the Safety Brief, "If you aren't having fun, tell us or do something about it yourself!" Kind of a no-nonsense, common-sense statement, if you ask me.

 

I made my own fun, in spite of being injured, overheated, and tired on Sunday, and my Saturday was just as fun with being a part of the command staff. It was an eye-opening experience with some of the best players that Milsim has to offer. Thank you to AMS, Colorado milsimmers, and anyone else on the field for a great weekend. I look forward to playing there again, no matter what side I'm on....

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Fair enough we will get to the bottom of this.

Hey Nate,

 

You know me and my integrity and I'll tell you myself, in my own experience, CDF did at least one time attack my squad. Shortly after lunch on Saturday my Sheep were tasked with moving from Caen to Coleville and linking up with Dwayne (Sp?). We were told we had to beat UFS there and then escort him to wherever he had to go. We found him waiting at the spawn point on the Southern end of Coleville and escorted him through the woods to the West of Caen where we met with CoST Marines and picked up an artillery track.

 

My Sheep all clambered onto the track and the Marines fanned out to provide security as we escorted the track to our FOB. We encountered the CDF buggy along the road approaching from the front. When it saw us, it made like a mouse droid, backed up and sped off away from us. The buggy attempted to move around to the rear of our collumn and upon doing so deployed a squad of CDF personell. CDF then engaged the Black Sheep and the CoST Marine element; however, were very quickly neutralized by superior fire power. That was the only resistance we met escorting the track to the CoST FOB.

 

Now, I don't know if this was a specific mission given to CDF by admin staff to attempt to give a little resistance to our mission as the only UFS forces we engaged were four random rifleman during our escort of Dwayne or if CDF deliberatly engaged us for another reason. Yet, there is no doubt that it was CDF.

 

This was the only time I saw CDF attack CoST forces the whole weekend, but if it happened to me, there certainly could be merit to some of the other claims. Simply because Eric or you or Rob didn't do it, doesn't mean everyone else played by your rules.

 

/hugs

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Just like dutch said, we train HARD, these guy have no idea. Weeks? Mouths. Many times a week. Nights, when ever we can squeeze it in. Days and days of work on just one project. Hundreds of phone calls in just planning. Its crazy.

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Bane, that incident was an assigned opfor against us by Ams. The players there were fighting alongside of us before and after otherwise.

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Bane, that incident was an assigned opfor against us by Ams. The players there were fighting alongside of us before and after otherwise.

Yeah, I figured it probably was. The mission was a little bit too easy and I thought that CDF was probably tasked with giving us a little oposition. Also, since we walked right back out into the fray at Pegasus right next to CDF it had to have been an assigned task.

 

I just brought it up since there seems to be so much controversy surrounding CDF's involvement, but since I assumed they were tasked with it, I haven't been bitching about it. It ain't nothing but a thing. Were you one of the Marines, Bagel?

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I've been "CO" or cult leader/sheriff/warlord/mayor/governor for various civilian factions over the last couple years and enjoy it. But for team affiliations at BH1 and ORY, I would have probably signed up for CDF, but after 5 AMS ops with tan, I'm solidly UFS and my feelings for you rebels and your indeginous friends are like this Imperial's:

 

 

What I have seen is that when someone signs up to be civilian (including me), they don't want to be in a rigid command structure and have to follow orders. Part of the civilian experience at an op can be bouncing between sides as a spy for one side or even a double agent, being an outright heavily-armed and psychotic criminal, trying to survive as an innocent in a warzone weaponless armed with only your wits, or fighting alongside heavy infantry as a lightly armed skirmisher. Of course, doing any of these things can have repercussions for your fellow civilians, as we are seeing here. As the civilian leader, I enjoy the job of making amends with the military and trying to protect my peeps -- who often are outnumbered and outgunned -- from the wrath of the larger forces, even while I'm aware some (and I may not know which) are spies, outlaws or partisans. 

 

 

 

So far the best compromise, we've reached has been to use a partisan armband system, so civilians can clearly identify with the side they want to be on and the understanding is that once a civilian places that armband on, they are within the command structure of the side they choose. I know Random mentioned that his guys were wearing ohnly CDF patches and no CoST flags, which was a good start, but I would suggest CDF players bring two bandanas or have two armbands be issued to them a green (CoST) and a blue or tan (UFS).

 

 

AMS has created an incredible back-story for its operations and it would be entertaining to see something along the lines of the television series Jericho or graphic novel DMZ worked into the game-play. The hard part is balancing those elements and still provide a straight-up BLUFOR vs. OPFOR encounter for players looking for just that and nothing more.

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